{"id":41,"date":"2009-08-10T10:00:29","date_gmt":"2009-08-10T09:00:29","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/?p=41"},"modified":"2009-08-10T10:00:29","modified_gmt":"2009-08-10T09:00:29","slug":"real-men-dont-do-church-part-two","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/carls-thoughts\/real-men-dont-do-church-part-two\/","title":{"rendered":"Real Men Don&#039;t Do Church &#8211; Part Two"},"content":{"rendered":"<div id=\"_mcePaste\" style=\"position: absolute; left: -10000px; top: 0px; width: 1px; height: 1px; overflow-x: hidden; overflow-y: hidden;\">Men today still look for robust and strong environments to forge friendships. \u00a0They may not express it like this but men really do desire authentic relationship. \u00a0Men want a \u201cband of brothers\u201d that they can stand shoulder to shoulder with. \u00a0So, they shoot off to the pub, to the match, curry house or the lodge meeting! \u00a0In reality men don\u2019t expect to find a band of brothers in a church, so they just don\u2019t look there. \u00a0For the most part, major male driving forces are money, sex, and power. \u00a0I\u2019m sure some of you will want to argue that with me (and yes I am painting a broad brush-stroke picture) but before you do, just consider the most popular question men ask when getting to know another man:<\/div>\n<div id=\"_mcePaste\" style=\"position: absolute; left: -10000px; top: 0px; width: 1px; height: 1px; overflow-x: hidden; overflow-y: hidden;\">\u201cWhat do you do for a living?\u201d<\/div>\n<div id=\"_mcePaste\" style=\"position: absolute; left: -10000px; top: 0px; width: 1px; height: 1px; overflow-x: hidden; overflow-y: hidden;\">Why is that the most popular question? \u00a0Simply because men instinctively want to work out the hierarchy and the pecking order in the new relationship. \u00a0It\u2019s why when you go to an expensive gym you see men place their car keys on the bar with the brand of car on display (unless like me you have an Eastern European car!) \u00a0It\u2019s why men say \u201cI\u2019ve got the BMW parked outside\u2026.\u201d instead of \u201cI\u2019ve got the car parked outside\u201d.<\/div>\n<div id=\"_mcePaste\" style=\"position: absolute; left: -10000px; top: 0px; width: 1px; height: 1px; overflow-x: hidden; overflow-y: hidden;\">Men will instinctively (thanks in part to the media) believe that what the church has to say about those issues will be diametrically opposite to what they want to hear. \u00a0For the most part they are right. The publishers of some of the best selling quality men\u2019s magazines know want men want as a result of extensive and expensive research. \u00a0You can read some of it in on the internet and it makes for fascinating reading. \u00a0Their livelihoods and profit margins depend on them featuring content that men are interested in and so they make sure they have got it right. \u00a0By contrast, in the church we don\u2019t research the culture, nor do we even read the magazines and therefore we so often fail to hit the spot. \u00a0Call me an old fashioned orthodox Christian, but I truly believe that we have people\u2019s eternal destinies at stake, not a mere profit margin. \u00a0We need to engage in some serious thinking and cultural engagement.<\/div>\n<p>Men today still look for robust and strong environments to forge friendships. \u00a0They may not express it like this but men really do desire authentic relationship. \u00a0Men want a \u201cband of brothers\u201d that they can stand shoulder to shoulder with. \u00a0So, they shoot off to the pub, to the match, curry house or the lodge meeting! \u00a0In reality men don\u2019t expect to find a band of brothers in a church, so they just don\u2019t look there. \u00a0For the most part, major male driving forces are money, sex, and power. \u00a0I\u2019m sure some of you will want to argue that with me (and yes I am painting a broad brush-stroke picture) but before you do, just consider the most popular question men ask when getting to know another man:<\/p>\n<blockquote><p><em>\u201cWhat do you do for a living?\u201d<\/em><\/p><\/blockquote>\n<p>Why is that the most popular question? \u00a0Simply because men instinctively want to work out the hierarchy and the pecking order in the new relationship. \u00a0It\u2019s why when you go to an expensive gym you see men place their car keys on the bar with the brand of car on display (unless like me you have an Eastern European car!) \u00a0It\u2019s why men say \u201cI\u2019ve got the BMW parked outside &#8230;\u201d instead of, \u201cI\u2019ve got the car parked outside.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>Men will instinctively (thanks in part to the media) believe that what the church has to say about those issues will be diametrically opposite to what they want to hear. \u00a0For the most part they are right. The publishers of some of the best selling quality men\u2019s magazines know want men want as a result of extensive and expensive research. \u00a0You can read some of it in on the internet and it makes for fascinating reading. \u00a0Their livelihoods and profit margins depend on them featuring content that men are interested in and so they make sure they have got it right.<\/p>\n<p>By contrast, in the church we don\u2019t research the culture, nor do we even read the magazines and therefore we so often fail to hit the spot. \u00a0Call me an old fashioned orthodox Christian, but I truly believe that we have people\u2019s eternal destinies at stake, not a mere profit margin. \u00a0We need to engage in some serious thinking and cultural engagement.<\/p>\n<p>Take for instance the issues of status and success. \u00a0These are of huge significance to many men, which is why their work is of such importance. \u00a0Yet church rarely, if ever, tackles workplace issues head on. \u00a0You could easily attend most churches for years and come to the conclusion that God isn\u2019t interested in what happens 9-5 at all! \u00a0But where does that leave men?<\/p>\n<p>Carry out an audit; take a look at your church. \u00a0When did you last hear a sermon on work? \u00a0Do you have a theology of work? \u00a0When did the church last pray publicly and seriously for those at work? \u00a0In general we are great at praying for the so called \u201ccaring professions\u201d but when have you heard a prayer for a Tesco van driver, a policeman dealing with child abuse work, a solicitor handling divorce work each week or a train driver who must spot the red lights or endure the trauma of suicide attempts?<\/p>\n<p>We pray for those in \u201cfull time Christian\u201d work and we tend to pray for those in teaching or medicine (because they are perceived to be more Kingdom orientated as they are caring professions) but we leave out the vast majority because we haven\u2019t developed a robust and holistic theology of every day life. \u00a0When it comes to teaching in church, Christian men &#8211; let alone those yet to believe &#8211; will sit under sound and tremendously accurate Bible-teaching only to wonder what\u2019s in the service for them. \u00a0The preaching deals at best with generic issues, or with churchy or touch-feely things, and the very things that absorb so much of a man\u2019s time and energy mid-week are never mentioned. \u00a0While we sit under teaching about how to pray better or give more, most men will be thinking about the challenges of the week ahead.<\/p>\n<h3>Consider the real things confronting a man at work this week:<\/h3>\n<ul>\n<li>Setting Profit and Loss<\/li>\n<li>Stress<\/li>\n<li>Fiscal control in hard times<\/li>\n<li>Negotiating Skills<\/li>\n<li>Human Resource Management without exploitation<\/li>\n<li>Empowerment<\/li>\n<li>Integrity in advertising<\/li>\n<li>Leadership<\/li>\n<li>Handling redundancy \u2013 each side<\/li>\n<li>Submission<\/li>\n<li>Conflict Resolution<\/li>\n<li>Sexual Harassment<\/li>\n<li>Discrimination \u2013 race, gender, religion, disability<\/li>\n<li>Time Management<\/li>\n<li>Work, home, church balance<\/li>\n<li>Personal ambition<\/li>\n<li>Debt issues<\/li>\n<li>Late payment terms<\/li>\n<li>Negotiating parameters<\/li>\n<li>Knowing when to close down<\/li>\n<li>Employing Christians because they&#8217;re Christians<\/li>\n<li>Materialism<\/li>\n<li>The place for compassion<\/li>\n<li>Self Image<\/li>\n<li>Corporate sponsorship of Christian events<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>Let me emphasise again: <strong>Men are being spiritually starved in church and they are voting with their feet! <\/strong> The decline in male attendance at church is almost terminal. \u00a0\u201cBelieving\u201d men are switching off to church at an incredible rate. \u00a0We desperately need churches to engage with men on the real issues they face.<\/p>\n<p><em>Part three will be published on Wednesday 12th August.<\/em><\/p>\n<div class=\"linkwithin_hook\" id=\"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/carls-thoughts\/real-men-dont-do-church-part-two\/\"><\/div><script>\n<!-- \/\/LinkWithinCodeStart\nvar linkwithin_site_id = 897245;\nvar linkwithin_div_class = \"linkwithin_hook\";\n\/\/LinkWithinCodeEnd -->\n<\/script>\n<script src=\"http:\/\/www.linkwithin.com\/widget.js\"><\/script>\n<a href=\"http:\/\/www.linkwithin.com\/\"><img src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.linkwithin.com\/pixel.png?w=750\" alt=\"Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...\" style=\"border: 0\" data-recalc-dims=\"1\" \/><\/a>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Men today still look for robust and strong environments to forge friendships. \u00a0They may not express it like this but men really do desire authentic relationship. \u00a0Men want a \u201cband of brothers\u201d that they can stand shoulder to shoulder with. \u00a0So, they shoot off to the pub, to the match, curry house or the lodge [&hellip;]<\/p>\n<script>\n<!-- \/\/LinkWithinCodeStart\nvar linkwithin_site_id = 897245;\nvar linkwithin_div_class = \"linkwithin_hook\";\n\/\/LinkWithinCodeEnd -->\n<\/script>\n<script src=\"http:\/\/www.linkwithin.com\/widget.js\"><\/script>\n<a href=\"http:\/\/www.linkwithin.com\/\"><img src=\"http:\/\/www.linkwithin.com\/pixel.png\" alt=\"Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...\" style=\"border: 0\" \/><\/a>","protected":false},"author":4,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_links_to":"","_links_to_target":""},"categories":[3],"tags":[39,113,125,204],"aioseo_notices":[],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/p7PoLK-F","jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":7228,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/news\/international-mens-day-2016\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":0},"title":"International Men&#8217;s Day 2016","date":"19 November 2016","format":false,"excerpt":"So you might have seen that as well as this being \u2018Movember,\u2019 Saturday is International Men\u2019s Day, a day that has been set up to recognise and explore the concerns and challenges that men face. This year the specific focus is; Stop Male Suicide. I am sure there will be\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;News&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/wp-content\/uploads\/2016\/11\/international-mens-day.png?fit=927%2C839&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":53,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/carls-thoughts\/real-men-dont-do-church-part-four\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":1},"title":"Real Men Don&#039;t Do Church &#8211; Part Four","date":"14 August 2009","format":false,"excerpt":"Getting men into the Kingdom is a topic in itself.\u00a0 But for now here are a few things we believe as a ministry are crucial if we are to win men for Jesus.\u00a0 Make sure your church: has a long term strategy to reach the men outside the church. recognises\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Carl Beech&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":1156,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/news\/the-gathering-now-taking-bookings\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":2},"title":"The Gathering &#8211; Now Taking Bookings","date":"19 November 2010","format":false,"excerpt":"In June 2011 men of the UK will gather in a field near Swindon. They will come from far and near, in ones and twos, in small and large groups - by bike, car or minibus. They will gather for a weekend. Tents will be put up. BBQs will be\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;News&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":401,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/news\/where-have-all-the-men-gone\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":3},"title":"Where Have All The Men Gone?","date":"9 February 2010","format":false,"excerpt":"In an article from the 9th of February Steve Doughty of the Daily Mail picks up on the problem of male attendance in the church, as highlighted by the Church of England. Dwindling numbers of men at Church of England services have resulted in a 'testosterone deficit' among the faithful,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;News&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":36,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/carls-thoughts\/real-men-dont-do-church-part-one\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":4},"title":"Real Men Don&#039;t Do Church &#8211; Part One","date":"7 August 2009","format":false,"excerpt":"Men believe themselves to be self-sufficient, all-capable and in no need of a crutch, so why be a Christian? \u00a0That\u2019s for wimps and women isn\u2019t it? \u00a0And nothing at all happens in church that is of any relevance to men, does it? \u00a0And lets face it, frankly a church meeting\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Carl Beech&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":48,"url":"https:\/\/www.cvm.org.uk\/blog\/carls-thoughts\/real-men-dont-do-church-part-three\/","url_meta":{"origin":41,"position":5},"title":"Real Men Don&#039;t Do Church &#8211; Part Three","date":"12 August 2009","format":false,"excerpt":"Let\u2019s think now about the more personal issues that a man faces.\u00a0 Sure, there will be a fa\u00e7ade that most men construct that says, \u201cHey, I\u2019m doing just great\u201d but behind that there is often a much more raw reality. \u00a0Many men are really wrestling with issues such as sexual\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Carl Beech&quot;","img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/41"}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/4"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=41"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/41\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=41"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=41"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.cvmen.org.uk\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=41"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}